Achieving Your Most Valuable Asset In Real Estate Passive Investment With Gabe Petersen
“Don't try to do everything ring less, voicemail texting, email, cold calls all this stuff all at once. Because then your effort is going to be dispersed and it's not going to be very effective. And your results are going to reflect that. So choose one method, one medium, nail that down, master it and then move on to the next.”
Gabe Petersen is the founder of the great Northwest homebuyer homebuyers, a principal at Equal Housing group, and most importantly, the host of the real estate investing Club. With extensive experience across many different asset classes and strategies, Gabe decided to start what you know today as The Real Estate Investing Club podcast and YouTube show.
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Achieving Your Most Valuable Asset In Real Estate Passive Investment With Gabe Petersen
Brett:
I'm excited for our next guest. He is the founder of the great Northwest homebuyer homebuyers, a principal at Equal Housing group, and most importantly, the host of the real estate investing Club, which by the way is pretty amazing. It's its number one internationally ranked business podcast on Apple Apple podcast and where he discusses wisdom from today's top real estate investors. And in today's episode, we are going to be discussing generating off-market leads in commercial real estate. And with Gabe Peterson. Gabe, welcome to the show. How are you doing?
Gabe:
All right, Brad. Yeah, thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here.
Brett:
Absolutely. Glad to have you and excited to dive into your story. So, let's start with that. What is a little bit more about yourself? If you could please tell us and you also tell us a little bit about your current focus?
Gabe:
Yeah, for sure. So my I mean, my story is like a lot of investors, people in real estate out there not linear at all, I got started. When I was going to college, I was getting a degree in philosophy. I was going to be a lawyer. I started going and shadowing some lawyers who realized that it wasn't for me, I graduated college, I was like, What the hell am I going to do with my life? And I started to incorporate. So I was in. I worked in consulting for almost 10 years. But I just did not like life and I needed some way out. And so I kept searching. I tried launching a few businesses. Ecommerce even brought him up to like 20,000 a month but didn't like that life just because he was staring at a screen all day not interacting with people. And that's when I saw one of those ads, you can flip a house and make a billion dollars. And I was like a billion dollars sounds great to me. So I got started in real estate and flipped my first house. I was a triplex in Tacoma for a long time, I don't even remember the year probably 2014. And then from there, I just got into a wholesaling single family. And you know, the story has been up and down since then. Now my focus is mobile home RV parks, and the new focus is self-storage. I love those asset classes. So that's where I am today.
Brett:
Beautiful, gave a great, great introduction. And by the way, you can learn more about Gabe Peterson at the realestateinvestingclub.com, that's the realestateinvestingclub.com game, so I believe we've all been given certain gifts in this life and these lives. And these gifts were given to us to be like a blessing and help to others. Some people call them strengths. Some people call them superpowers, I believe their God-given gifts. And these gifts again, are something that maybe you recognize at a younger age, perhaps when you were in high school or college and maybe someone told you about these gifts, maybe you kind of stumbled upon them. But I'm curious, what are those one or two gifts or strengths that you believe you were given? And how does that help? How did you help him bless people today?
Gabe:
One or two strengths. Let's see. So I think I think you're right, I think everybody does have strengths and weaknesses. One thing that I've just noticed, throughout my whole life that I've always just kind of had is vision, I can see the future, as they say, I look into the future and look at my goals. And I can communicate and pursue a vision. Something that kind of life has given me is that I don't think anybody is necessarily born with, but his persistence and just staying at it, especially in real estate. It's I mean, persistence is the number one thing you need, you need to be able to just keep going down the road and not give up when you hit those roadblocks. So that's I think, one of my strengths now, but I don't think I've had it my entire life. It's something that I've had to learn along the way.
Brett:
Excellent. So persistence, vision, and then being able to communicate and pursue that vision. Love it. Those are great gifts. And thank you for sharing those. So let's dive right into the best way to generate off-market leads in commercial real estate. So what's the number one secret guide that most people overlook? When it comes to generating off-market leads?
Gabe:
Go Yeah, and I love this topic. When it comes to generating leads, there's a ton of ways to do it and no one way is the right way. That's what I feel is important. You can if you master any of the different methods of generating leads that and that that method is going to bring you what you need so you know i can say this is the one that's working best for me right now but that doesn't mean that if you're also pursuing these other methods it won't also work for you if you just put the time in and master it and get really good at it but when it comes to different different channels the ones that I've found to be most effective when it's talking about off market leads is first is ring less voicemail ring less voicemail is super effective it does take a lot of data so you need to have a really good data set for it to work ring less voicemail and then direct mail obviously the oldie the goodie one that has been working for for you know hundreds of 1000s of investors over the years direct mail is still effective people are hating on it these days but i still think it works especially if you're talking about smaller smaller properties that aren't you know they're owned by kind of a mom and pop owner and then third is texting I don't really like text marketing that much but there is that people have seen a lot of success I've seen some success with it but that is it's an avenue that i use and then online so ppc Facebook ads everything that has to do with your website is another great way you can also do organic marketing so creating a podcast anything like that anything that creates content puts it out there put your name out there establishes trust with the people that are listening engaging with you is a really great way to generate leads and the last one is actually technically not off market but it is off market because it hasn't been listed but i think brokers are a great way to get off market deals because a broker when they get their deal they're not going to if they have somebody who already they know is going to be a great buyer they're going to take it to their list before they go to the market and so i think creating relationships with brokers creating relationships with other investors is a great way to generate off market leads especially in the commercial space and even single family i mean the more the deeper and the better and the more strong relationships you have in your whatever career you're doing you're going to generate more business that comes to your to your to your business.
Brett:
Awesome. So direct mail ring less voicemail text marketing content creation like podcasting and then developing relationships to
brokers are all great ways.
Gabe:
Email, email. Sorry about that.
Brett:
Yeah. An email see, I probably a drip system automation emails so yeah a lot of those are kind of known I kind of want to focus on the ring less voicemail I feel like that's probably one that's most overlooked perhaps and maybe you mentioned it first as well so the first thing would be what's the best way you found to get the phone numbers right so you get real good numbers what is the system to effectively do that what do you do?
Gabe:
That is definitely the hardest part of text marketing the hardest part of ring less voicemail even direct mail is getting good data and that i mean that is where you will kind of the effort you put in is kind of you earn the leads there because it is hard to get that good data it's hard to get valid data that actually goes to owners and not to you know property managers not to some blank LLC something like that so really skip tracing having a good skip tracer and finding good data sources is key there's a lot of different way you know sources out there to find good data i mean you can go to the department of homeland security has some really good base sets that you can use but once you get that base set you really got to work work the set and and find you know skip trace it find good owner contact information and not you know not LLC information property manager information anything like that so really working the data once you do have the set and it doesn't matter what asset class you're talking about you can go out there and you can find any data set mobile home parks single family multifamily anything like that property radar is one i think i started with list source was the first one i use but that's super expensive so there's plenty of data out there you just got to find it and then you got to you got to work it you got to find the actual owner contact information in order to get that to work and to do that I mean there's a bunch of different ways to skip trace you can skip trace with lead Sherpa is a good first pass they don't really have a great hit rate but lead Sherpa does work batch skip trace and then the the kind of hard but very effective way is to actually hire just hire a VA and tell them to go on to you know the corporation's division for the state and find the find the LLC owner and then go and actually skip trace that individual LLC owner so it can be laborious but it's very effective.
Brett:
Excellent. Okay so skip tracing And property radar list source, hiring a VA using these different systems. But are you? So you're probably hiring that out, right? Because you probably don't want to be in the nitty-gritty of all that you want to have someone else doing that. And then Are you hiring someone full-time? 20 hours, 30 hours, 40 hours is this like, number one thing that you're doing, you know, walk us through? Walk us through your actual steps to do this? What do you do?
Gabe:
Yeah, I mean, the first part, you have to find a good VA, not somebody who I know, it's really hard to find a good VA is not gonna lie. And that is I don't have an answer for you here, you just got to test them, send them a test task, see if they perform well on that if they do give them a little bit more work. But when you're talking about working with VA’s, it just depends on your, the volume you need. So if you mean if you are ready to slam it, if you got people behind the phones, ready to pick up the calls, and you need a good source of data, then you can go up to 10, 20 hours. I've been just doing five hours a day or a week for the VA because that gives me enough data to work on. But if you've got a huge team behind you, and you need a lot of data, yeah, push it up.
Brett:
Excellent. Makes sense. Thanks for sharing that. All right. So that's number one is ring less reach, and then you're in these voicemails. And so hey, this is Gabe Peterson, I'm calling about the mobile home park that you might or might not have for sale or be thinking about selling, walk us through a little bit of the script to be able to generate these off-market leads.
Gabe:
Yeah, I actually, don't remember the script that I have. But generally what it says if I remember correctly is, Hey, my name is Gabe, I'm a mobile home park investor, my assistant found your park online, it's something that I may be interested in offering on. And if you'd like to receive an offer, no obligation whatsoever. Just give me a ring back and we can talk about it. Get little details about your property. And then I can send you an offer.
― Matshona Dhliwayo
Brett:
Perfect. And so it's very general meaning because you're doing this to 50 mobile home park owners within a City right?
Gabe:
Yeah, so you can, there are different ways to go about this. But the message that I send out is super general because I don't want to have to create a new message for every, every Metro that I go into. But if you did create a message for you know, say you're in Austin, Texas, and you're sending RVM to Austin, Texas, it is going to be a more effective RVM blast, if you say awesome, he's like, Hey, I'm looking to buy a multifamily. I'm looking to buy retail in Austin. I'd love to talk to you, that message is going to be received better, it's gonna have, it's gonna be more effective than just saying, Hey, I'm looking to buy a property in your area.
Brett:
I think also adding maybe a deal story or your track record, your performance, right? Are you finding yourself doing that to bring some credibility? Or how are you establishing credibility?
Gabe:
So on the RVM itself, I don't say any of that. The RVM's main intent is just to pique their interest. And just to get them to call you once they call you. That's when you start creating a relationship, you start building rapport, tell them what you've done in the past. And you can talk about the property about what they may want out of the property, what their situations like when they may be interested in selling. And that's another thing when it comes to generating leads and working those leads, is the vast majority of the time, you're not going to be closing whatever closing means for you, you're not going to be closing that lead on that day, you're I mean, you're gonna have to follow up, we do. Or I do an email sequence that follows up with them a text sequence that follows up, I put them in my calendar, give them a call six months out of the way if they say hey, I may be interested in selling in June, give them a call the next month, give them a call the month after that, once they express interest, that's when the real work starts. That's when you start working that lead. But the point of the RVM is just to get them to call you just to pick up the phone and say hey, got your RV, or I got your voicemail. And I'm here to talk.
Brett:
Make sense. You don't want to do it, you want them to come off. If you're selling anything, just say Hey, my name is Brett and I buy mobile home parks or buy multifamily, you know, or sell deferred sales trust, you know, And hey, if you're open to selling your property or you know, give me a call and no obligation and just wanted to see if you'd be open to that. Is that a fair summary?
Gabe:
Yep, exactly. Excellent. And also the reason one of the reasons I like RVM better is I feel they're less intrusive. There are some pretty intrusive forms of marketing. I think field text marketing can be kind of intrusive, but RVM like literally it just doesn't even ring them. It's just a voicemail, it just drops into their phone. They can delete it if they don't want to if they don't recommend a number they don't want to listen to it they can just go ahead and delete it so I feel like it's not it starts the relationship off a little warmer a little better so you're not coming off as the aggressive salesperson you know some of your property so they're not picking up the phone like you asshole you called me whatever is a little bit nicer.
Brett:
Yeah it makes sense, yeah you wouldn't just rush into you know someone's neighborhood and start yelling you know, and if you think about it as you walk into like a cul de sac right and there's all these these these these imagine there are 10 houses you wouldn't be like hey you selling your house you would you might just go hey my name is Gabe, my name is Brett if you're open to selling your house let's talk right so it makes perfect sense yeah I think too often you know I also have to pull myself back because I get excited or you know or get you to know to want to get it out but you got to be listening to be patient make a general offer trying to make a handshake and then try to give some information is that a fair summary of follow up information is a fair summary, Gabe?
Gabe:
Yep. I think that's perfect.
Brett:
Awesome. So that's the secret number one was to generate off-market leads essentially that we talked we touched on a number of them but ring less voicemail I think is something perhaps we can all take advantage of and help to reach out for more people okay so what's secret number two now perhaps it's in the follow up perhaps it's in it's something that's overlooked what would you think we could help on that, Gabe? For generating leads, it's in the conversion, maybe the tip and the follow-up? What would be any thoughts on that?
Gabe:
Yeah, so the first one obviously just chooses a channel and then sticks with that channel until you master it. The second, there's so many tips that you can go down especially when it comes to interacting, you know your first touch once they've reached out and they express interest. The first step has to be quick, time kills all deals time definitely kills all leads if you're if you're waiting a day, two days to get back to a lead that that reached out to it, it's maybe dead there's a good chance that it's dead so you time kills all deals you got to jump on a lead once they expressed their interest if you're sending out an RVM, be ready be beyond the phone have your phone right there to grab those calls don't send it into voicemail. Voicemail is not an effective way to get them right when they're there after that the biggest tip. I'm not the best at this and i need to improve on this but it is long term you need to continually develop that lead as I said the first one's not the first touchpoint. It's not going to be the sale most likely sometimes it is which is awesome but usually it's not. And so you need to keep developing that relationship relationship over time keep checking in with them and that's why you shouldn't be super aggressive out on the first call on the first touch point because it's usually a long game and it's not going to work that first time through you really need to show trust, show them that they can trust you, show them that you know you are the right person to buy their property and keep keep doing that keep showing up keep showing them that you're trustworthy over time. And eventually enough trust will build up when they are ready to sell. They'll think, hey Brett, he was an awesome guy I've talked to him, six times over the past five months I really liked him, I think I want to sell to them they'll pick it up the call or their phone give you a call and close that way.
Brett:
Perfect. I love it, Gabe. I couldn't agree with you more and also it makes me think of what's called the value ladder. Russell Brunson talks about this book in his multiple things but especially the book Expert Secrets and he talks about someone to get to know you and to give something of value especially in the very beginning could be like an e book, right? That could be the first step of the value ladder. I didn't ask for anything in return and it was free and it's really easy and it was quick right? I like the thought of definitely time kills deals time kills leads and also that first touch being quick and they can have a chance to get some value then the second thing might be like a podcast or might be like a an actual full book that you wrote or or some kind of webinar that you're giving or something of that nature where you could start to develop the relationship more add some more value help them to get to know you a little bit more and then hey there might be an offer at the end of that is that a fair summary, Gabe?
Gabe:
Yeah for sure. And I follow a guy called Frank Kern in the online marketing space and I love his kind of his philosophy on this he does a lot of online marketing, the ad Facebook ads, Google ads that kind of stuff. But he's really big on developing relationships without talking to people via ads and once a person goes to your website submits the offer or submits their contact information you call them. They're not ready to sell at that point, you set up remarketing ads, you set up email touchback points and just continue to give them value. So the first remarketing ad, if you're selling single-family houses, and you deal with people who are going into foreclosure, first remarketing ad maybe, hey, this is an eBook I wrote, it goes through the top 10 points or the top 10 issues most people run into when they're dealing with foreclosure, here's a way to solve it just that you might like it, make it a video, look into the camera, say, Hey, I saw you went to the website, just wanted to let you know I created this book, you can have it for free, go here. Keep remarketing, keep touching, getting those touchpoints in the actual number. I can't remember where I learned this, but you have to have seven touchpoints to get a sale. So you have to touch them seven times before the sale goes through. So just keep that number in mind and use all the different avenues to hit that number before you close.
Brett:
I love that. And another thing I also added to my business was what's called a pre-close or per-client due diligence portal, right? And it's like, here's a to z, what you need. And it's logged on, it's custom, once you have that free consultation with me, and if you qualify, then we'll move forward and the next step, and now they can go there and they can go through kind of like a mini-course, right? And FAQs, and there are videos and there are walkthroughs. And there are short snippets. And that helps them to know because we're in the Netflix, on-demand Amazon Prime, an era where people want to access information quickly. And they want to access it multiple times and have different periods, so that is also something that I've done, which is pretty cool. And in Click Funnels. If you've heard of that, you should check it out. It's a great way to help build those out in an easy way. Okay, cool. I like Frank Kern. I think Frank Kern and Russell Brunson do some stuff together anyway. Yeah. Which is not surprising. So all right, excellent. To develop long-term relationships. And to use automation choose a channel by that I think you're referring to choose a maybe a social media channel, but maybe you can clarify that.
Gabe:
Just choose a channel being a marketing channel, it can be anything, if you want to focus on direct mail, just destroy your direct mail systems, just really hone them to make them perfect. So just choose whatever medium you want to get good at. And nail that medium down until you know until you actually mastered it and then move on to the next one. Don't try to do everything ring less, voicemail texting, email, cold calls all this stuff all at once. Because then your effort is going to be dispersed and it's not going to be very effective. And your results are going to reflect that. So choose one method one medium, nail that down, master it and then move on to the next.
Brett:
Perfect. That makes perfect sense. Because by the way, I signed up for like ring less reach, like I bought the guy called the guy ring less reached me, I called him back. And I bought the $500 thing. And it sits and sits there for a year and part of this because it's good because I've been focused on other things. And I'm like, I don't have the time to focus on this yet. But it's there. But yeah, I think I need to just say Okay, the next 60 days, or 30 days, whatever, 90 days, I'm going to focus like a laser and let's say, for five hours a week, I'm going to just do ring less reach for my outreach. And then until I've mastered that, and then once I've mastered that, sure, then you can go to something else. But you're right. If you start to try to do everything all at once, it's like spinning a bunch of plates, and they're all gonna fall. Is that a fair summary, Gabe?
Gabe:
Yeah, for sure. And also, once you've mastered it, it's great to go through a process, yourself first, really understand it understands how it works, but then document it, record videos that show the process, really document how it works, the best way to do it, pass it off to a VA, that's what VA is are great at is following a process if the process is well understood. So you master it, get good at it, understand it, then put it into a process doc pass it off to a VA let them handle it.
Brett:
By the way, document a little tip here and make your screen share right, use a thing called Loom or use Zoom, and do a screen share and record yourself. And then and then and then categorize these into different places. And like such as there are four things that every company in every business has. The first part is called ACDC, right? "Attract". The second one is "Convert". The third one is "Deliver" and the last one is, ACDC right? And the last one is "Collect" ACDC left that was the 80s band right Gabe, that you like?
Gabe:
Oh yeah, they have great songs.
Brett:
So it's ACDC, right? I guess it is the same, right? Attract, Convert, Deliver, Collect. And so as you're making these videos and as you're mastering what you're doing, document it, right? And then make little short snippets it could be a five-minute video or three-minute video and then move it into one of those four and then and then that's a whole another thing about hiring VA is perhaps Gabe and we should have another show on that but I've got five right now Gabe but just real quick how many VA's are you currently working on right now?
Gabe:
I only have three, they each have the specific things we are doing one of them is helping me with data and the other one is helping with a podcast and then just a general admin that kind of bits of help with some of the systems that I work right now I'm mostly doing our VMS that's you know I have enough leads with just that and so our VM is so simple once you get the data right it's the easiest of all the channels and so I don't need somebody to do that for me it takes me five minutes to do it but you know I used to do a lot of PPC ads that are a little bit more intense I would work that's a little bit higher than an RV you're going to have our VA there we go you're going to have to hire that out needs a little bit more experience and expertise but once you get the process down hire VA they can run it.
Brett:
Amazing. By the way, you can learn more about Gabe Peterson the realestateinvestingclub.com. He's out of the great state of the Washington Tacoma area and he's looking to buy a mobile home park right, by the way, multifamily and self-storage, and he's done wholesaling so all that being said Gabe, are you ready for the lightning round? Let's hear it all right. What's your biggest frustration when it comes to capital gains tax deferral and or the 1031 exchange?
Gabe:
Frustration is just I don't have enough knowledge in that area and I know there are huge gains to be had there but just my lack of knowledge is a problem and so it's something that I need to learn a little bit more about.
Brett:
Yeah. By the way, that's what we do here at capitalgainstaxsolutions.com. We give you clarity on your options and the 1031 exchange also the deferred sales trust you can go to capital gains tax solutions calm and also quick plug we're working on a lot of cryptocurrency cases right now like we can actually defer taxes on the sale of cryptocurrency and then you can use those funds to invest into real estate the deferred sales trust is a powerful way to do that also works for primary homes and businesses and can save a failed 1031 exchange go to capitalgainstaxsolutions.com that's capitalgainstaxsolutions.com. Next question Gabe is this favorite book that you've read or gifted the most in the past year?
Gabe:
Let's see, a favorite book, I always go back the only book that I ever gift is Meditations by Marcus Aurelius it's one of my favorite books and I like stoic philosophy I think it's a great thing for anybody to learn and understand meditations it's Marcus releases just journal essentially that he took when he was in the field in you know on his campaign and it's great wisdom so that's probably the book that I would choose.
Brett:
Excellent. I'm gonna check that out. Meditations, Marcus Aurelius. Question number two, what's the best real estate deal you've ever done?
Gabe:
Best real estate deal I've ever done... I would say the one I mean best is a very subjective term but I'm going to choose this mobile home park out of the first mobile home park I did that I purchased in George Washington which is funding the city is George in the state of Washington. And it's just it was the first one it was a great deal so this is a cold call we got it through a cold call and the owner was a large potato farmer like he is the potato king here in Washington Washington is one of the biggest producers of potatoes and this guy just rules I love those this guy just rules the nest when it comes to potatoes and so this park wasn't a huge concern a priority at all to him so we negotiated terms he gave us like gosh I don't remember the exact numbers but I think it was like a 19 or a 21 cap or something like that on actual.
Brett:
That's amazing.
Gabe:
Yeah, it was absurd or it was pro forma but the issue that he had so he had water leaks in his pipes in his water pipes and so his utility bill for the year was like shit I don't remember specifically but I think it was like 80% optics so like he was just crushing all of his…
Brett:
He's throwing money out the window.
Gabe:
He just had it going on like this forever. He didn't care so he sold it to us. We fixed that and got that out of the way and it was a great property.
Brett:
Well as a metaphor for life sometimes, right? It's like we have these water leaks. And certain areas of our lives are like not doing ring less reaches or text follow-ups or whatever, right? And we're just throwing money out of the window, right. And so to become expert, commercial real estate professionals and or operators and buyers and investors, we've got to look for those leaks. And then sometimes it takes hiring a coach or getting with someone like Peterson or myself to help you with that. Right. And I got coaches too. So I think that's just a good segue. good reminder, don't be letting all the money go through your pipes, leaky pipes. All right. Next question. What are you curious about right now?
Gabe:
What am I curious about? So Self Storage is something on the horizon that I've been interested in, in the past. I like the idea of nothing against tenants. Tenants are great, it's great to have tenants. But I like the idea of doing something that doesn't involve people living on the property. And I don't want that to sound. I feel like that sounds bad. But I just like the idea of self-storage. It sounds like a great asset class, I've always been interested in it. And so I'm curious about learning it. This is, I've just started over the past two weeks, I got a huge data set. And I'm already skipping tracing. And so that's, that's what I'm curious about is how that works. For anybody out there. Does self-storage. Reach out to me? I'd love to love to chat.
Brett:
Absolutely. Last question. After all your success gave helping so many people have been one of the number one rated podcasts in the international world? How do you stay centered in your values? And how do you stay encouraged to reach for new heights?
Gabe:
How I say centered in values is definitely to surround yourself with people who reflect your values. And so you spend time with people who match your values, they don't have to match you. It's great to have a diversity of personality, diversity of beliefs. But when it comes to really fundamental values, to reinforce those values, it's really good to have people surround themselves with people who reflect those values. So that's probably and then also books, reading books that kind of reinforce what you truly believe is good in life. And so books and then just people, the people you surround yourself with.
Brett:
Amazing Gabe. For the listeners who want to get in touch with you. Would you mind one last time? What's the best place for them to connect with you?
Gabe:
Of course, it's the realestateinvestingclub.com. It's a podcast, we go through all of the different asset classes. So if you want to learn a little bit about investing, come on over there. Brett was a guest on the podcast we talk all about capital gains DST. So come over there check Brett's episode out. It was a good one. Yeah, realestateinvestingclub.com.
Brett:
I appreciate that plug. Gabe Peterson and I also appreciate all of our listeners listen to another episode of the capital gains tax solutions podcast as always, we believe most commercial real estate brokers also commercial real estate owners and realtors they struggle with clarifying their passive income options not having a clear plan is the enemy and using a proven brokerage model such as the eXp commercial model, and purchasing investment real estate is the best way for you to grow your wealth. I'm Brett Swarts. And you can learn more about all of that, by the way, go to expertcresecrets.com it's expertcresecrets.com. We're also streaming on capitalgainstaxsolutions.com we touched on the deferred sales trust you haven't heard about that you can go to capital gains taxes calm to learn how the deferred sales trust can save a failed 1031 exchange help you raise more capital, add more value to your clients and be the Netflix to the way people exit highly appreciated assets versus the old blockbuster ways go to capitalgainstaxsolutions.com for that. Thanks, everybody for listening and we so appreciate you being a part of our listenership, bye now.
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